Shooting under threat, what is going on?

What is going on?

DavidBASC on Pigeon watch, talking about policing the lead ban and who is going to be the policeman. Also talking about bringing in the Scottish lead ban rules into England and not allowed to use lead within 250m of water on game shoots.

BASC web site asking to government to publish the report into Breeding cages, they say the report is now 3 years overdue.

Are BASC really pro-shooting or have I mist something?

Then you have the talk report in the Western Morning News about the big bags and high bird shooting in the west country. Where does BASC stand on that issue?

These comment are what is called opinion forming, be PR spin to produce an outcome, I believe to get the game English shooter to think about not using lead within 250m of water and who is going to be the policeman. No one has said BASC yet.

So I will, do BASC what to be the policeman of shooting?
Are we going to see ever game shoot having a BASC monitor?

So I’m not taken to court over this comment I post the comments from davidbasc on pigeon watch and the BASC statement on breeding cages. Along with link to Western Morning News Article talking about big bags and high birds.

BASC statement on Defra game bird breeding study

Posted on Jun 18, 2015

BASC is calling on the Government to publish a game bird study which concluded in 2012.

Defra commissioned research in 2009 entitled ‘Study to determine whether cage-based breeding can meet the needs of game birds, and if not, to identify best practice’. It was concluded in 2012 but has not been published.

It is time for the Government to publish this study. Three years is a long time for it to be sitting around unpublished.

BASC also reminded its members that they should adhere to the Codes of Practice for the Welfare of Gamebirds Reared for Sporting Purposes.

Ian Grindy
BASC game and gameshooting committee


panoma1, thank you and I fully understand your point, I just council caution that any suggested change must be thought through carefully.

I accept this is a personal view, but for example on the shoot where I help with the ‘keepering, 7 out of 10 drives have a stream or pond within them, the shoot as a whole is ‘blessed’ with natural wetlands of this type and given the potential for shot to travel 250m or more,its not possible to simply adjust the positioning of the guns to prevent lead falling on to these features…I bet my shoot is not unique…

So my question is, is having the ability to shoot a duck over inland habitats with lead sufficient grounds for potentially restricting the shooting of all other species over a range of habitats that are not necessarily key holding areas for duck / geese inland?

Wymberley – the BASC logo was removed from the LAG site a couple of weeks ago, perhaps the page you originally looked at was the old one that was stored on your machine, but when you refreshed the site it took you to the current page.

I agree that those who oppose shooting will probably try any tactic to attack our sport.

I also agree that we must do all we can to stick to the law, not just in the case of lead but in every walk of life as I am sure the vast majority of us do, and self regulation is the best way to go, and not further legislation

However, its clear that some are still unsure of the legislation, hence the push by the shooting organisations to keep on spreading the word, although this is probably made tougher because we have different rules in different parts of the UK plus of course there are still a large number of active shooters who choose not to belong to any of the organisations

I would council caution though over enforcement, accepting your point that its unlikely government agencies may not actively police this, there is a risk that others will offer to, indeed this was a very real threat when the current legislation first came in when there was an offer on the table from non government body to police the ban! This was successfully fought off by BASC at the time I am pleased to say.
To try and clear the confusion, the wetland areas do not need to be specifically designated, its simply the reference to the Ramsar definition of what is or is not a wetland that is used in the Scottish rules

So as you see, there is still some confusion among even long experienced shooters as to what the law says, hence the need to keep pushing the message

As to which organisations put itself forwards to help police the regs…I give you three guesses…and i will tell you in the morning


Oh you have missed your chance, i was going to send you a bottle of malt for the correct guess! Well the offers closed now, never the less, if we ever meet at a show, i will but you a pint for trying
In fact it could have been just about anyone! The original enforcement procedures proposed by government would have given powers to local authorities to appoint whomever they saw fit to police the regulations. Imagine that!

I found this on the Shooting UK news web site, whom would have thought that the BASC would side with the LACS?

BASC urges Labour MPs to ban raised laying cages

• Shooting UK

• January 19, 2010•

Shooting UK news:

As DEFRA analyses the responses to its recent consultation on the use of raised laying cages, BASC has emailed a number of Labour MPs urging them to sign an Early Day Motion (EDM), which calls for an outright ban of the controversial cages.

EDM No. 507 was tabled by the Parliamentary spokesman on angling and shooting, Labour MP Martin Salter, and has now attracted 107 signatories at the time of going to press.

It reads: “This House notes with concern that several large game farms have introduced

battery cage systems for game bird laying stock and the available space in such cages is

so limited the welfare of the birds is seriously compromised and the system does not

conform, whether enriched or not, to the five freedoms which are the basis of the UK?s

animal welfare law.”

DEFRA’s draft Code of Practice for the Welfare of Game birds Reared for Sporting Purposes, which was published in November 2009, offers the industry three different options for using raised laying cages in the production of game bird eggs in England:

(1) Retaining the status quo.

(2) Requiring all raised units to be enriched and banning barren cages.

(3) Banning cages.

The Game Farmers Association (GFA), the National Gamekeepers Organisation (NGO), the Game & Wildlife Conservation Trust, the Country Land & Business Association, the Countryside Alliance and the National Farmers, Union are all calling for Option 2.

Organisations calling for Option 3 include BASC, the RSPCA, Animal Aid and the League Against Cruel Sports.

The NGO’s Lindsay Waddell said they were very concerned about BASC’s lobbying on the issue.

To split the shooting world and give encouragement to the antis as they have done is really unhelpful.

Mr Waddell added: “The NGO supports Option 2 on the basis that it was the recommendation of the government’s advisory body, the Farmed Animal Welfare Council.”

It would be a significant improvement on where we are now, stopping bad practice and barren cages but allowing essential and long-used systems, such as partridge laying boxes, to continue. We cannot see why BASC needs to go beyond this, let alone why they need to endanger the UK shooting industry.

The GFA has said the move risks ending all partridge egg farming in England as well as a significant proportion of pheasant egg production.

A spokesman said: “It could cause meltdown for the game industry and chaos for game shooting. Option 3 would end all partridge egg production in England. We know of no partridge breeding system that does not involve a cage of some sort. Every reared partridge shot in the UK comes from an egg produced in a cage, either here or abroad. Option 3 would also end any use of raised breeding units for pheasants, even those of the largest and best enriched designs, irrespective of their welfare merits.”

BASC, which has previously dismissed EDMs as nothing more than “parliamentary grafitti”, said it is alarmist to suggest the entire game shooting industry could collapse if Option 3 were chosen.

Responding to the industry’s concerns, a spokesman said: “We make no bones about pursuing our aim, which the elected Council and relevant advisory committees of BASC have long considered necessary for the future of game shooting, by all open and democratic means. If we are seeking to influence a Labour government, then of course we will lobby Labour MPs. BASC always takes an all-party approach to political issues and has lobbied on that basis.”

DEFRA plans to issue the finalised Code of Practice for the Welfare of Gamebirds Reared

for Sporting Purposes in April.




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